The reality is, is that this what we have now.



And the 2rd Coming of the Red Man is closer than its ever been, and can lead us forward.

Native Americans were not some holy conservationists, they took from the land the same as everyone else. In fact, if you were in upstate NY, you would be surprised what they are doing to the land.

I am sure glad the left is high most of the time, because it makes them to feeble to create much of this "change" they want..

Oh yeah, sorry about that. Q: "Gee, you mean socialists can be greedy?"

Of course they can. But true socialism strives to purge greed from the paradigm. It greatly discourages greedy behavior and encourages cooperation and fairness. Free-market capitalism, on the other hand, not only encourages greed but rewards it.

Was referring to:


But as to your other point:


The problem with this, is that the same greedy people who would partake in a capitalist system still exist in the socialist one. It is one thing to be greedy in a free market system where your greed and power is only buttressed by your desires. It is quite another to put the full faith and force of government behind them. Command type structures such as socialism end up putting all the power in the hands of the few and restricting the freedom of everyone else. There are no Einsteins and Edisons in these systems because these people are not free to attain whatever it is they consider valuable, be it money or respect from their peers because they are hampered by other peoples ideas of outcome equality.

Free market capitalism allows everyone to pursue their own agendas without government meddling, and every time this is maximized, it always benefits the entire society. The government has a role, but only as the judge and jury, not as a partner, picking losers and winners.

Take a look at any socialist or communist society and the one thing you will notice is that individual freedoms are scarce and the standard of living is pathetic.

Not only is your last statement untrue, nations that have developed hybrid socialist/democratic systems enjoy greater degrees of individual freedoms and have way better standards of living across the board. More importantly though, poverty and related conditions such as homelessness and limited or no access to health care are virtually non-existant. Their prisons are not overflowing, and their children receive a far better education than we presently provide.

Care to name one? Show me this self sustaining socialist utopia please.

Pick your own source. The U.N. has the most extensive stats, but also International Association of Social Workers (IASW) and Association of International Social Work Educators (AISWE) have great data. The U.S. consistantly ranks low on positive stats (healthcare; education, etc) and high on negative stats (poverty; homelessness; prison pop, etc). Countries which score much better include most European nations, Canada, and Australia. In most areas of concern we rank below India and China.

There is a great Solidarity Economy Group on Facebook that keeps up with lots of Community level actions of the people going on all over the World.

''The U.S. Solidarity Economy Network stands in solidarity with the Occupy Wall St. movement. As a network of groups, activists and solidarity economy practitioners, we seek to transform our economic system into one that puts people and planet front and center – an economy for the 99%. Another World is not only possible, it already exists, in many, many forms. The solidarity economy, grounded in principles of solidarity, participatory democracy, sustainability, equity in all dimensions, and pluralism (not a one-size-fits-all model) is a fast growing global movement. We offer these Solidarity Economy briefs to provide a glimpse into some of the aspects of the solidarity economy that exist all around us.''

http://ussen.org/library/books-articles?page=1

It sounded real cool last year, was it, that Iceland took a stand against the International Bankers and told them Iceland was going to default by mistakes by Banks there. What a thought provoking thought that that was to a bunch of us people... There is a video posted in comment section of this article, of a man speaking about allowing Countries to file for Bankruptcy. That was thought provoking to my mind's eyes.

''A time long ago, 2008, there was a small happy prosperous country. Some details about this country. It had a fantastic single payer health care system. In 2008, it was the closest to carbon neutral of all industrial countries. All of its municipal, industrial and residential energy needs were met by sustainable non-polluting hydro power and geothermal power. It was and is a world leader in developing hydro and geothermal power. It was planet friendly country on our poor planet. (Well, almost, they are a whaling nation, Alas.) It led the world in 19 disciplines within the Information Technology field. That was 2008, additional IT disciplines have been developed by this country since then. Healthy food, in a large variety, is available and affordable. Comfortable housing is available and affordable. Gainful and emotionally satisfying employment is enjoyed by most. It is impossible to describe the educational opportunities or the creative, healthy, leisure activities that are an integral part of the life of the people.''

http://www.care2.com/news/member/406091837/3115704



Yoko's Imagine Peace Tower in Iceland. Her tribute to one of Lennon's dreams.

''And, the government of Iceland lets the banks DEFAULT. Strange government. It does not believe that banks can be too big to fail. It does believe that the people are too big to fail.
So what does Iceland have left out of all of this ....?

Single payer excellent health care system, earth friendly power, people friendly food, comfortable abodes for all, enjoyable employment, world leadership in the two technology fields that will dominate the globe in the 21st century
AND the people of Iceland are living happily ever after.''

So you are saying that you can't show one can you? BWAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA!!! You are using the U.N. as a source? That is funny!

Leo, I want to give you a chance to think this over. Are you REALLY going to use Iceland as an example of successful socialism? Really?

Oh, and btw, letting banks fail is a CAPITLISTIC quality, not a socialistic one.

"Rather than bailout the banks — Iceland could not have done so even if they wanted to — they guaranteed deposits (the way our FDIC does), and let the normal capitalistic process of failure run its course."

( http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2011/05/ho ... e-iceland/ )

And what do you know? A little bit of pure capitalism went a long way to heal the sickness of socialism. Chances are though, they will be right back where they were a couple of years ago, because they still haven't learned the lesson that capitalism, not a bunch of empty headed do gooders, is the best hope for a society.

That story about Iceland was only published as an example of how Countries can take a stand against the International Banksters. Greece could of listened to its people, although it would not be a piece of cake for them... though may be a step out. In these complicated times, there is no one shoe fits all solution.

I am all for not bailing out the banks, just like any REAL capitalist. We should not bail out ANYONE, including unions, car manufacturers, POST OFFICES, etc..

The Post Office doesn't want to get bailed out. It would help if they could use what was overpaid in the pension fund, could be used to help keep up with the competition. In this 21st Century, there are other services they could provide, if allowed too. In many countries they used to do more than just delivery mail. What specifically is wrong with that.

But on a larger issue, its going to take, Public, Private, and Personal investments to build a sustainable economy for Communities to be able to take care of themselves.

They are already being bailed out. Subsidies to oil companies are just as wrong as subsidies to the post office..