Forums » Group W Forums » Topical Tropical Discussions

 


Post new topic Reply to topic
Author Message
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 11:06 pm
  

User avatar
Arlo Fanatic

Joined: Aug 25, 1999
Posts: 1883
Location: Wantagh, NY
Dave wrote:
Lunch anyone?

Attachment:
image0011.jpg



tsk tsk wiz, you shouldn't disseminate clearly false facts without giving them a quick once over...
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/roomservice.asp

at least come up with something not so easy, such as proof that McPain isn't actually the Pilsbury Doughboy in disguise!


          Top  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 6:04 am
  

User avatar
Arlo Fanatic

Joined: Oct 18, 2004
Posts: 2251
Dave wrote:
The term is extended to people who are clueless or bumbling, who don't understand what is going on.

Exactly who does this exclude from wearing such a hat?


          Top  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 7:03 am
  

User avatar
Arlo Fanatic

Joined: Sep 13, 2000
Posts: 8521
Location: Pixley-- Actually An Hr South of Richmond, VA
Yesterday, Mike & I were shopping in the cheap store Maxway. I saw some McCain shirts & told Mike I thought it was interesting they had no Obama shirts. Some lady heard us & said something about Oaama being the right one & he was for a change. Mike said something about he was thinking about voting for Jesus Christ that he's the best one. The lady said she knew Jesus but Obama was the one we needed in there. She started equating him to Jesus Christ lol. Apparently, they've got him elevated to God like status now lol...


          Top  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 7:06 am
  

User avatar
Arlo Fanatic

Joined: Oct 18, 2004
Posts: 2251
Wyldflower wrote:
Incidentally... the New York Post has retracted the erroneous report on Michelle Obama's "New York Snack"

http://www.nypost.com/seven/10212008/go ... 134490.htm


It makes no difference if stories like this are retracted...once they make the Nazi Radio Network they become folklore. The "Joe the Plumber" interviews (the normal guy that has voted Republican in every election of his life kind of interview) at a recent McCain rally in PA were very entertaining! Filled with all the not quite true mud that is the ear mark of the McCain campaign this year! It is all too bizarre?

Oh ya, and just imagine what would happen if a couple of Black Militants were planning on decapitating White People? Where is G. Gordon Liddy and the tricksters now?


          Top  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 8:41 am
  

User avatar
Arlo Fanatic

Joined: Jul 06, 2008
Posts: 2531
Images: 2
Location: Crawfordville, Florida
In war and political campaigns, truth is always the first casualty.....sadly, asshats are everywhere!


          Top  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 12:41 pm
  

User avatar
The W!zard

Joined: Aug 25, 1999
Posts: 1058
Images: 108
Location: Leonardtown, MD
Quote:
The Obama Tax Tolls
by Mac Johnson
Posted 10/29/2008 ET

Barack Obama makes two broad claims (lacking specifics) on taxes: one is that he will collect more in taxes, and the other is that he will not raise taxes on you. According to Obama, he can do this by focusing huge tax increases on only 5 percent of the population. Unfortunately, the 5 percent he has in mind is the 5 percent that has the most influence over the economy -- successful entrepreneurs, the upper middle-class, and the rich.

These are the people that pay the salaries and wages and insurance costs of most of the other 95 percent of Americans. To believe that these tax increases will not affect you (assuming you are in the 95 percent that Obama claims to be “spreading the wealth” to), you have to believe that the 5 percent to be taxed will just decide to be poor, to lose money, and not to pass the extra cost of Obama’s new taxes on to you.

Does Obama really believe that the rich got that way by taking losses or swallowing costs? When the price of gas or copper or labor or insurance or anything else increases, businesses and the people who own them have two choices: they can lose money or they can raise prices and pass the cost along to their customers. What do you believe they will do? If you need a moment to figure this out, you are probably a hardcore Democrat and you can stop reading now.

Anyone else, conservative, moderate, or apathetic, knows the answer: businesses cannot lose money. They will pass along any increased taxes in the form of price increases. The taxes they pay, you pay -- eventually. The only difference is that unlike the hated 5 percent of Americans that Obama openly brags of punishing with new taxes, you will not get a bill from the government declaring your new taxes. You’ll just pay more for milk and gas and credit and clothes and iPods and everything else you buy. At the end of the month, you will have less money and not know why. Doubtless, Democrats will tell you to blame the rich for that too.

It is a simple truth that businesses do not pay taxes, only economies pay taxes. Regardless of whom you tax in an economy, the costs of that tax are very rapidly spread throughout the whole system. Any business that fails to spread its costs in this way goes bankrupt. Obama may brag that he will spread the wealth, but all he will really spread is his new taxes.

To see how punitive taxation really works, let’s look at an extreme example: sin taxes. It was with glee that liberals in particular (and Americans in general) set about increasing taxes on tobacco. Allegedly, this was an attempt to punish the evil tobacco companies and discourage smoking. Between 1980 and 1990, for example, cigarette prices increased 154 percent, thanks in large part to increases in federal, state, and local taxes. What happened to tobacco company profits in that same time? Doubtless they plummeted as the evil tobacco barons finally got their comeuppance! No, actually, their profits were largely left intact. Philip Morris stock, for example, outperformed the S&P 500 over that decade by about 300 percent. And it is still chugging along today.

The people who got stuck with the tax increase were smokers -- already wheezing -- and overworked folk who were doing society a great service by paying into Social Security during their prime earning years and then dying before they turned 65 and collected. These brave, rasping, gravel-voiced tax machines then had less money with which to pay for televisions and couches and houses and sweaters and everything else in life, so the general economy suffered a slight decrease in growth. In other words, we all pay tobacco taxes, even those of us who selfishly don’t smoke and want to drain Social Security dry. A tax aimed at “rich” sinful corporations became a tax on common people and the poor. All taxes work this way.

If you cannot avoid a tax on tobacco when you don’t even smoke, how do you believe that you will avoid Obama’s tax on success? And a tax on success is all that Obama has proposed by singling out the top 5 percent of earners.

“I’ll screw somebody else” is not a very trustworthy political promise anyway, even if it does come from the liberal messiah, The Dalai Obama. We are all in the same economy and any money siphoned out of one part of America, whether that is the top 5 percent or the most-emphysemic 5 percent, ends up affecting us all.

You cannot drain water only out of the deep end of the pool, and you cannot tax money only out of the top 5 percent. When Obama claims otherwise, he is selling you a lie.

America’s economy is already sputtering. Slapping it with new taxes, collected from 5 percent but paid by 100 percent, would be a disaster. Combined with a Democrat majority in the Senate, a Democrat majority in the House, and a wildly left-wing cheerleading section in the media, there couldn’t be a worse time to put a tax-and-spend liberal in the White House.

The media may claim John McCain “just doesn’t get it,” but at least he gets who pays the taxes in this country. You do.


          Top  
Reply with quote  
Offline
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 12:45 pm
  

User avatar
Senior ArloNetizen

Joined: Feb 19, 2008
Posts: 560
Well, I wonder if you would agree that tax and spend is better than borrow and spend?


          Top  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 1:00 pm
  

User avatar
Arlo Fanatic

Joined: Sep 12, 2000
Posts: 6517
Location: New Jersey
old arguements made by the supply siders that may seem to make sense to the uninformed and have the effect of having the middle class vote against thir own interests. I run the family store that my father started in 1965. I can tell you for a fact that over the years, our biz has gone down EVERYTIME a republican was elected president. The Reagan republicans view him to this day as an economis genius, but remeber when he was there, he used our mastercards to pay our visa cards bills, much like Bush is doing now and the chickens came home to roost later with a soft economy when the bills really came due. It's smoke and mirrors, snake oil etc. to fall for that crap. It's based more on ideology and the super rich trying to maintain the largest of margains between them and everyone else than it is fact or any kind of intelligent thought or study. In a word...."spin". Look back at the past few presidentail cycles and it's very clear to see. It's why Clinton beat Bush I, as as you might recall he cleaned it up great and left a surplus and a good economy to his asshat son, who promptly screwed it all to hell.
Give me facts,pragmatism and clear intelligent thought over failed ideology any day.


          Top  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 1:16 pm
  

User avatar
The W!zard

Joined: Aug 25, 1999
Posts: 1058
Images: 108
Location: Leonardtown, MD
Larry wrote:
I can tell you for a fact that over the years, our biz has gone down EVERYTIME a republican was elected president.


May we see your books please? Since I notice you only mentioned what happened to your biz when a republican was in office. What happened when the left had all the control?


          Top  
Reply with quote  
Offline
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 1:41 pm
  

User avatar
Senior ArloNetizen

Joined: Feb 19, 2008
Posts: 560
Well, when did the left have All the control? Soon though. Very soon.

And guess what, he's not a muslim either, as so many people seem to believe, because they need a reason to HATE,

He said while Billy Bragg and Wilco blare in the background..."all you fascists are bound to lose, you fascist are bound to lose, you fascists are bound to lo-o-ose, you're bound to lose."

Great music to redeem a country by.


          Top  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 1:41 pm
  

Senior ArloNetizen

Joined: Dec 22, 2001
Posts: 980
Location: big D, little a, double l... a, s
Wiz...

I thought you were being original... I got this message today in an email from another of my conservative brethren.


Forwarded Message: Wealth Redistribution Wealth RedistributionTuesday, October 28, 2008 6:34 PMFrom:



Here is a creative approach to redistribution of wealth as offered in a local newspaper...

Today on my way to lunch I passed a homeless guy with a sign that read "Vote Obama,
I need the money." I laughed.

Once in the restaurant my server had on an "Obama 08" tie, again I laughed as he had given
away his political preference--just imagine the coincidence.

When the bill came I decided not to tip the server and explained to him that I was exploring t
he Obama redistribution of wealth concept. He stood there in disbelief while I told him that I was
going to redistribute his tip to someone who I deemed more in need--the homeless guy outside.
The server angrily stormed from my sight.

I went outside, gave the homeless guy $10 and told him to thank the server inside as I've decided
he could use the money more. The homeless guy was grateful.

At the end of my rather unscientific redistribution experiment I realized the homeless guy was grateful for the money he did not earn, but the waiter was pretty angry that I gave away the money he did earn even though the actual recipient deserved money more.

I guess redistribution of wealth is an easier thing to swallow in concept than in practical application.


          Top  
Reply with quote  
Offline
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 1:58 pm
  

User avatar
Senior ArloNetizen

Joined: Feb 19, 2008
Posts: 560
And in your mind that is equal to how Obama's plan works?

To take more taxes from those who make over $250K/yr and figure out how we can use this money to solve our current problems, rather than borrow from China and India as we have been doing. And to end a $10B/mo funnel to rich corps (Iraq), is this equal to giving your tip for good service to the beggar outside? Really? You think different than me.

Funny but true story...

A few years back, my wife, my mom and I were downtown, leaving a local eatery. While wating for the valet, we were approached by a female panhandler asking for money. I had never been asked for money by a homeless woman before. I gave her $5. My mom, a life long republican said, "She is just going to use it on drugs or alcohol." I said, "Mom, thats what I was going to do with it anyway." She hit me with her purse...


          Top  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 2:18 pm
  

User avatar
Arlo Fanatic

Joined: Sep 12, 2000
Posts: 6517
Location: New Jersey
Dave wrote:
Larry wrote:
I can tell you for a fact that over the years, our biz has gone down EVERYTIME a republican was elected president.


May we see your books please? Since I notice you only mentioned what happened to your biz when a republican was in office. What happened when the left had all the control?


It went up, everytime.


          Top  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 3:00 pm
  

User avatar
Arlo Fanatic

Joined: Sep 12, 2000
Posts: 6517
Location: New Jersey
Oh and Wiz, please don't confuse me with an extreme leftist when it comes to economic issues, I consider myself more of a centrist.
However, extreme right wing policy is largely what has created this current mess. Alan Greenspan, Reagan's economic brain even suggests this when he explained that he thought when he was making policy the banks and mortgage industry would "protect" their shareholders if he let them self regulate. He, and we know how that has worked out.
I like capitalism, and running the family biz means I'm more involved in it than you are as a goverment worker. I submit that there needs to be balance. Remember that the basis of economics is the control and distrubution of resourses. Our country has declined in the production of products owing to mis-steps and greed on both sides. Jobs being shipped overseas owing to corporate greed, as well as well intentioned labor unions sometimes asking for too much and not understanding certain economic realities and talking themselves out of jobs at the bargaining table. With an economy more and more based on services and less and less on production, jobs will become fewer and fewer and they will not pay as well. This hurts everyone. Planning for the changing domestic AND global economy is complicated and requires planning and strategy for both the domestic and global componants. This is where intellect AND pragmatism is going to be required of our next president. It's clear to me that Obama has both of those qualities to a much greater extent than does McCain, and certainly Palin. In fact the Obama/Biden ticket probably has a mean I.Q. of about 100 points higher than the McCain/Palin ticket. McCain is stuck with the deregualtion supply side 19th and 20th century ideaology that is something that cannot work in the future.


          Top  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 3:21 pm
  

User avatar
Arlo Fanatic

Joined: Sep 12, 2000
Posts: 6517
Location: New Jersey
Remember that economic philosophy is not a religion. One can change ones mind about things and adapt to new conditions witout offending a supreme being.

http://finance.yahoo.com/expert/article ... ist/117255


          Top  
Reply with quote  
 
Post new topic Reply to topic



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 25 guests


Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Jump to:  

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group