Oops!I kinda strayed, from HST-style, there, huh, Todd...!?! well. we'll see, sometimes, even HST went at it, str8 up......
what's this "segway" scooter thingy? guided by thought? howz that work? i dont get it, but i think I want one...could a person steer that thing, while practicing selective obliviosity??

Ok, it's moved! Sorry, Larry takes sundays off around here! I was in a casino in Atlantic City yesterday with my dad, he won, and I made a donation to the "Donald Trump I need even MORE money Fund". I forgot to wear my lucky Arlo shirt. Carry on.

<center><FONT COLOR="#000080">--- Edited 1 times, lastly by Larry on Dec 03, 2001 ---</FONT></center>

Cool, Larry, thanks, hey, the psychic selective obliviosuty telethon is working!
many new converts, over the weekend, Wyldflower's gonna do a zen sunday school class, I think Ceashel will agree to be mother superior, she wants me fitted for a Burka, though, i dunno about that.. oh and, POpe Todd needs a Moke, a Pope-Moke.. Im a little worried about him, though, I saw him countin beans, earlier this am....

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Bumper:
... oh and, POpe Todd needs a Moke, a Pope-Moke.. Im a little worried about him, though, I saw him countin beans, earlier this am....<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thems wasn't beans, Bump!
Thems was Moose Poops!

posted by ters
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>
I don't believe any good comes from war
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Outcomes happen in the strangest of ways...My friend Jim was stationed in Japan during the Viet Namn conflict. He met his wife Yoko, and had 3 beautiful children, once they made it state side....

I think it was good, War guys kicked 'Hitler' in the pantzy's....<img src="http://www.arlo.net/ubb/smilies/axe.gif" width=39 height=20>

When Osama bites the big one, I will rejoice...Can't help my human emotions.... <img src="http://www.arlo.net/ubb/smilies/alien1.gif" width=25 height=16>

Yeah..the Hitler thing is a stumbling block for many who'd like to be pacifists. It ceratainly always has been for me. The thing is..it seems obvious that the world would be better off if humans didn't wage war. The question is what to do if someone really, really wants to wage war. Can you always refuse the invitation? I don't think you always can.

i don't think so either, Pat...and yet... as a boy told my friend, Bill, on his bus route ,,"It all started, when he hit me back..."

I know, Bumper. One of the things that I've learned, and not wanted to learn, in the last few weeks, though, is that not hitting back in the past seems to have sent an unintended message. It would seem so obvious to us that we're huge and over-match small countries or other entities that might attack so we use restraint, and much of the world expects and demands that we do, whether our powers that be of the moment prefer it or not. Now it seems that that very restraint is interpreted as inability or unwillingness to defend against attack. It's a different view of the world and the concept of restraint when you don't have to use it doesn't seem to be something that the people driving this round of troubles seem to be able to get their minds around.

It's like, I'd wear bells in bear country and try to avoid a confrontation. But if a bear were charging me, I would try to kill it. I would cry later, but I would still try to kill it. Or I would be dead. It may mean I need more rounds on the wheel, but there it is.

True Pat, Al Qiada and Palestinian groups are saying, "Capitulate, or we will kill your civilians, in random, gross ways" That's a good definition of terror, I suppose. and, perhaps only sheer raw power will deter that, but, I doubt it..the ideological gulfs are so wide, and the terrorist mindset so fanatical, that the beat may just go on....

What gets me about all this is that I can't even figure out my own feeling, positions, etc. Not something I usually have a problem with.

Typically I'd say I'm a pacifist, but against religious psychos with a gun to my head, I may just push back. Not because I believe it will solve the problem, but because it I loathe their mental illness so.

So while I understand what Bush is doing, and support his good intention, I still believe he is simply sowing the next generation of hate. I hope I'm wrong, and he's right, and that 20 years from now we'll live on a planet free of terror and religious rule.

I remember Lennon at the bed-ins, which I assume was pushing pacifism. Wonder what John would say about a response after seeing his beloved NY attacked.

Situational ethics are always handy to bring to bear in a pinch.

I'm a pacifist generally speaking; and about as non-violent as you can get, short of turning into an inanimate object. I also know that given the right -- maybe I should say, 'very very wrong' -- circumstances, I'm perfectly capable of killing another human being. I'm just as capable of sacrificing my own life to save someone else's.

Being human would seem to make us a regular knot of contradictions ...

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>
Muffy said:
Being human would seem to make us a regular knot of contradictions ...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>...which is why Blundering fits so well. It really helps me to be around like <img src="http://www.arlo.net/ubb/smilies/angel.gif" width=25 height=20> and unlike <img src="http://www.arlo.net/ubb/smilies/reddevil.gif" width=16 height=16> (you know who you are!) minds, where I can say how confused I am, without being attacked as a "pinko" or something "much worse." I don't even care for pink. This is harder material than organic chemistry was!

I hate agreeing with GWB about anything, but doing as much to disrupt organized and state sponsored terrorism as possible is probably all we can do. That doesn't mean I endorse every single thing the administration is doing about it, but it was my first reaction to the 9/11 attacks - we have to put these people out of business.

As far as sowing the seeds of terrorism in the future...I don't know, but it seems to me that everyone has a grievance. Timothy McVeigh was a white American male, and he was a terrorist and he was applauded by some as you probably recall. Those people, although they had their grievances, are people with whom vast numbers of people in the world would gladly change places, just for the opportunities that being a US born citizen would provide, let alone a white male one, no matter what they had taken away from them. What was left was more than so much of the world has. Put that together with the fact that terrorism rarely accomplishes anything for the perpetrators or the groups they claim to represent and I'd say that the motivation for such acts isn't something that can be addressed effectively.

Pat, I'm glad you made the 'Tim McVeigh' anology...He was turned into a Folk hero by some.....(definately not me)!!

* If only Tim knew he'd have more work on down the line (Gulf Veteren) maybe he would of had something to live for??? But somehow I dought it...

**hating America is nothing new. Just realize it more, now that Countries are at war..... I can understand certain cultures for the diss-dain, but hate Americans who hate....double negative, but that's how I feel! How can you hate a country? Now my younger brother....THat's REAL hate!!!