ShannonO posts;

Todd why did you feel possessed to post the lyrics to a No Doubt song on a thread about the war?
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i wish i knew, lady...i wish i knew. except maybe that today's pop culture makes me mad enough to fight?!...

don't worry your little/big head about it though...it was meant as commo to someone and they recieved it and responded.

I wasn't one of the non-posting viewers either, by the way. Just so's you know, Todd. My feelings had been hurt and I stayed away for a few days to get over it.

As for the tuition aid, it was something I'd just read about, which is how that got mentioned. (Keep the poor ignorant, huh? Good idea. That's sure to keep them down.) I do know all about being bullied and the mechanics of victimization and oppression, believe me. When one is vulnerable, one becomes a veritable bully magnet, so well I should. If I'm a little skeptical about anti-American sentiment, it's because so often it's a propaganda tool, used to shift blame from where it belongs. U.S. 'foreign policy' is a tasteless joke as far as I'm concerned, but it would take an essay -- if not a book -- to even begin to tackle the subject as a whole.

For me, anyway. However, I'm not doing anything in music now, which (adversely) affects the way I write prose, among other things. The music has to express itself, one way or another. But that's another essay at least, those dynamics are. Or a song. Or something.

yep, you're out there!!! saw you sulking away via remote viewing..lol!!

there's a difference between a flake and a hippie, ya know?
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suicide bombings seem to be minute by minute events anymore...i fear our war has become a charlie foxtrot!

Good for you, Shannon... I don't give a damn what people have, on their heads, I worry about what, if anything, are in some of em, though...just cuz you are Todd, doesn't mean you don't get a mild rebuke, ya know...
Shonnon in one ear & me, in the other.. that'll put a head on your Guiness!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by todd:
there's a difference between a flake and a hippie, ya know?
[QUOTE]

Todd c'mon aren't we being a little harsh? I mean you say some pretty flaky stuff, far more so then most people on this board, but we don't say shitty things to make you feel worse about it. Or at least I don't!

Muffy I don't blame you for being hurt or staying away, but I have come to believe Todd thinks with his mouth instead of his head when he posts at times. I've done the same thing and got in hot water for it, and rightfully so! <img src="http://www.arlo.net/ubb/smilies/axe.gif" width=39 height=20>
However I do have to disagree with you about you being skeptical about "anti-American" sentiment. I don't think there's anything "anti-American" in critcizing the government. I think not only is it naive not to, it's insane to think that anyone in politics can be completely trusted to handle our affairs. Screwing over the little people is after all, what government does best.

If anything is "propaganda" it's the near-feverish Patriotism that knocks anyone who is a political cynic (sp?), and jumps all over those of us who don't wave the flag and praise Dubya ad nauseaum and finger-point at those who question Bush's competence simply because we are in a state of war. That, to me, is scarier then any authority questioning this country's citizens raise. I'm not saying you are like that. From what your intelligent posts have garnered, you don't sound it at all. But accusing one of being "anti-American" simply because they don't agree with this country's government, even while we are at war, is a bit judgemental. <img src="http://www.arlo.net/ubb/smilies/confused.gif" width=15 height=22>

"Shonnon in one ear & me in the other...that'll put the head on your Guiness!"--Bumper
Bumper you are the Quote KING!!! Erin go braugh!!!! We Emerald Isle folks gotsta stick together!

<center><FONT COLOR="#000080">--- Edited 1 times, lastly by ShannonO on Feb 19, 2002 ---</FONT></center>

"First, learn the meaning of what you say, and then speak." --Epictetus

heehee, see Todd? me jus a likkle Rasta-Irish bwoy, ya kno......jus cool, all well..!

see what?? yep, you all sure put me in my place.

next thing we know is you'll be applying
standards and expectations...oh, you're already attempting that..nevermind.

the flake/hippie thing was the front of a joke...guess i'll save it for a more receptive audience. was a time that could be found in theses parts?

now back to whatever these fng's are doing...

todd...
i'm on your side, man. i guess my quote crashed...
i think you rock...you know that! you are one of the only people who is completely true to themselves. i respect that completely.
some of us just need to learn that we don't have wings, so we cannot yet fly...

no kerry, i took your quote as support..and as making sense...which is a bit more than i get out of bumper and his minions of gashes.

todd...you're making more sense to me lately. is it me or is it you...and should i be scared? <img src="http://www.arlo.net/ubb/smilies/wink.gif" width=15 height=15>

great quote, kerry!

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by deb:

todd...you're making more sense to me lately. is it me or is it you...and should i be scared? <img src="http://www.arlo.net/ubb/smilies/wink.gif" width=15 height=15>
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

what's the difference deb? be scared either way!!!

hey todd! you know me.. i'm always sittin' in the audience! we all know the sound of one hand clapping...

I guess Todd makes as much sense as anything in this world and more than some..and that's not scary, that's terrifying.

Shannon, my problem with some of the domestic anti-US sentiment that was expressed immediately following 9/11 is that it didn't seem to involve any more thought than the current patriotic fervor and in some ways, less. Patriotic ferver was very understandable under the circumstances. Some of the groups that oppose the US government, often on sound grounds, seem to hate it so much that even terrorism and fascism as practiced by such fanatics seem preferable to them.

I never said that criticism of our government constitutes favoring terrorism. I condemn anyone, anywhere, on any grounds no matter WHAT country or government they belong to on committing terrorist acts, and that includes my ancestor's Ireland (the IRA), and that includes the USA (the CIA).

Saying that bulliying from one countries justifies an act of sheer unholy horror is just as deplorable as saying all Middle Easterners should be deported because the people who perpatrated this act were primarily Middle Eastern. The scariness is on both sides, the extreme Patriotism, and the opposing end.

But I really urge caution in automatically labeling any criticism of this country's government as "anti-American". There is nothing Anti-American about critisizing the government. Our first amendment allows us that right, that freedom. Saying we should be bombed and attacked, that is Anti-American, but fearing our politicians, our foreign policies, and the way the world views us, that isn't anti-US, that's just being realistic about our situation in the world.

You (Pat) also said that it was understandable considering the circumstances, the ferverent patriotism that ensued soon afterwards. I think that skepticism, and citing what caused these events to unfold is just as understandable. It's foolish to say that we had no indications of violent enemies before this happened, and it is also foolish to think that there were no reasons behind this beyond sheer evil. That doesn't mean those reasons justified the acts. Nothing does. However, that doesn't mean other countries don't have good reason to take issue with us (albeit in a non-violent way).

By ignoring theses issues and adamantly waving a flag instead, we're only inviting more attacks by pretending there is nothing wrong with what we do or have done, as well as what they have done.

Todd, I knew you needed an antidote to all the "warm, fuzzies" can't have you gettin all complascent & expectin a free ride, w/ every key stroke you type, ya know...if you got all fat & happy, you wouldn't be worth pocket fuzz, on the next stealth mission..
"It's rough out there,
high water everywhere"