It's not about human life this time, but this story made me weep. Sometimes it's just hard to understand why we are even here.

I agree that this is truly a great loss for the world. What makes it worse is that some our people should have been assigned to prevent just this kind of thing.

The Iraqi people are so very angry at having been repressed for so long, I sort of understand this... a massive version of a teenager "acting out" after having suffered an unjust punishment. My heart is heavy once again, because of the loss of so much ... the hospitals, the museum, and now the libraries...

AND... our hospitals (health care system), our libraries, our educational system... are in jeopardy too, because of the massive cuts to programs, and because of the repression of the Patriot Act. Where do we direct our energies? It is soooo difficult to know what to do!

It just amazes me that anyone would loot their own heritage. I heard from a "reliable" source that the main reason the US troops aren't stopping it is to prove to the world that the Iraqis aren't quite ready for self-rule, thereby justifying US intervention in the interim government.

Is this like the tail wagging the dog?

i'm not quite sure how to respond to this one...i think how i feel about this 'war' is clear from other posts..but i also dont know that it's 'fair' to put the responsibility on the shoulders of our troops when iraqi people are treating their own treasures with such disrespect. i'm not saying we shouldnt have had a contingency plan in the event that the country and it's people werent as pleased about us being there as we expected...but i also dont know that much 'law and order' could have been kept given the behavior of so many people who were abusing their new found freedom.

like any other situation, each individual made a choice..and many chose unwisely. i can 'understand' a staving person looting a grocery store when given to the 'crowd' mentality...but that isn't what happened in this case.

of course, the flip side of this...is that (thank god) there truly arent many of us who can relate to what these people have been through and how we would react given the same situation. i hope and pray it would be different.

one other comment and then i'll get off my soap box.....if we had 'gone in' to stop the looting and 'innocent' iraqis were killed in the process...can you just imagine what people would be saying then (including these boards)????

ok.i lied...one more thing....to imply that the marines just sat there doing 'nothing' is unfair. they were doing what they were commanded to do. it's not like they can just 'do what they want' and there is no telling why they were doing or not doing something at any given time. suicide bombers not withstanding, the same kind of chaos was seen at the end of woodstock 99....just something to think about...

Man, that is bad. They need to preserve their heritage...

That was our heritage, too. It's sad and so ironic that this war would result in the destruction of the physical evidence of the beginnings of human civilization. But blame the Iraqi people? Blame the marines? No. By the time the destruction occurred, both were just playing out roles set up by the leaders on both sides. The leaders had to know it would happen unless they took steps to prevent it; anyone who took history in grade school would know it. Blame Saddam Hussein? Donald Rumsfeld? George Bush? You betcha.

As a librarian, this really hits me hard. But I was just as disappointed to see the destruction in the National Museum. It's counterproductive to try to point blame, and you've all made good points as to why/how this could have happened. It's like a kid getting freedoms he/she's not ready for--those freedoms are often misused, but one day that kid wakes up to what they've done. Sad, very sad.

Worth reading:

From Baghdad: Other Hearts

WOW, all I can say is Sherry when you got to it, it rocked. lol . Sincerely, I see both sides of this story. Remember I'm the guy who's into book clubs. So books in themselves, no matter what part of the world they're in, I have great value. Minds can be changed, time can be less violent. Reading is just good human sence!!! In all fairness how many kids read in your neighborhood, compared to the old days??? With kids living the fast lane via internet, DVD'S VHS tapes, mini disc, cell phones, ect., ect., ect.!

* I've done everything but give up on youger folks in the ol usa reading? NTM countries like Iraq. I imagine there are some ausome Authors in Iraq, or from Iraq. My ignorance tells me of none that come to mind. Like explaining to someone that Arlo is Woody's son. And when they don't know Woody till this land is your land story goes. Well ya know what I'm talking bout now.

But I don't think the Marines are paid to take care of books. Regardless of said situation. I just don't. I think Ceas you might come to this conclusion. Reading other post helped me make my opinion. As I'm a tree hugger and might have sided with you.

* With suicide bombers on the loose. Plagues, and disease running rampant among the natives, it seems prioritys are numbered. The military seems to be going out of it's way not to leave bad impressions. But you'll always get the arguement, too much calateral damage. I don't argue the point, but I sure as hell sleep better at night, calateral damage or not, than thinking another master mind plot, killing hundreds of thousands on American soil. As cold as that might sound. We've lost allot of friendly fire deaths, along with a few Black Hawk downs. One just 40 minutes down the road from me. Fort Drum NY 10th Mnt. division. I'll be glad when this is over!!!

<img src="http://www.arlo.net/ubb/smilies/peace.gif" width=16 height=16> Rb

They also had the zoo there in Baghdad raided & looters taking animals except for the really dangerous ones. The zookeeper is really concerned for the animals. Saw this on the news & sorry to hear about that...

rb, please re-read what I said. I did not--and emphatically do not--blame the marines or the soldiers. Before the war started, the archaeological community advised the White House & Pentagon in writing, officially, that this needed to be a top priority, and told them why, but while Bush and Rumsfeld did choose to risk lives to defend the Ministry of Oil buildings they chose to leave the museum and library to their fate.

*We're not talking books only, it's also the stone tablets containing the first written laws, Items directly tied to Abraham, items going back almost 10 thousand years. We can't replace them. If we can defend the Oil Ministry buildings, why can't we defend those? Which will matter in a hundred years?

(Why is it so hard to say you're against what the administration is doing and not be perceived as criticizing the troops?)

<center><FONT COLOR="#000080">--- Edited 2 times, lastly by Ceashel on Apr 19, 2003 ---</FONT></center>

I don't think that anyone is blaming the troops or their officers, up to but not including whatever level they get input into policy. Tommy Franks..don't know..maybe. But certainly the Bush, Cheney, etc. gang. They went to Iraq with regime change as the agenda. As an occupying force they are charged with keeping order and providing security. They were advised that they needed more troops than they had there to do that. They didn't listen. If you went into any city in the US and took out all authority and law enforcement, how long would anything of value be left alone?

Ceashel please understand I understand you plight! It's hard to please everyone, and even tho this magic box, helps make friends, sometimes things are lost in the black & whiteness of it all. I'm sorry if I missread your sintiments!

I really don't wanna go over this war issue, altho I'd love to talk to anyone about it IN PERSON. I'd have little to say. Trust me. I do realize, fucked up things happen in war.

*As far as them protecting the oil> I would guess that's a dangerous sitution. If the well's catch fire, pollution, and waste are a given. It would be worse than the worst Oil Spill ever. (I tend to exaggerate) But the pollution factor alone, is worth saving lungs. The non-replaceable items you talk about, are replacable. Just like an old house fire. Pictures get lost. Jelery gets ruined. All the sentimental stuff you owned in your short lifetime is gone. I've been thur it. It's an analogy at best. My possessions will never compare to what was lost in Iraq, but none-the-less, I miss them. I think we should keep to the old 'Star Trek' rules, and never fuck with the main objection of a land. OR PLANET <img src="http://www.arlo.net/ubb/smilies/alien2.gif" width=15 height=17>

I sure hope this straightens things out Ceas, as your a beautiful person with smart things to say. Thanks for being you! Say Hi to Jay for me!

<img src="http://www.arlo.net/ubb/smilies/peace.gif" width=16 height=16> RLB

rb,
Hi right back at you from both of us. I agree, emotions seems to be getting in the way of dialogue and understanding between us on this issue right now, so let's hop to another board and figure out what book to read next. (NOT a political one!)<img src="http://www.arlo.net/ubb/smilies/wink.gif" width=15 height=15>
--Ceas