Arlo said here that he was gunna do a protest concert? Did you say that Arlo? If you did, I didn't hear you. You gotta speak louder at the keyboard I guess?

According to this article, they saved the train...

http://www.rednova.com/news/display/?id ... technology

Well I don't know allot about business, politics or charity for that matter. I do know I'd sure miss that ol St. Lawrence Central Train that rolls behind my back door, every Tues. and Thursday, About 10 am....

SO many folks have stopped to visit, ( on a tuesday or thursday ) hanging out in my back yard mostly watching Ocean Liners on thier trek to Lake Ontario.... Only to be totally freaked out when they hear and see the train... Stating Jesus Christ that train is still in operation??? I thought the Port Authority got rid of that yrs. ago...

It's then I explain, that it only travels on Tuesdays and Thursdays... And sadly enough, it is no longer a passenger train. Just a few car loads of whatever ( Salt, sand, railroad ties, steel... Whatever the special of the day is)...

The City of Ogdensburg had the great idea of returning it into a passenger train again, a few yrs. back, but nothing became of it...

I figured the Bureucrats squashed it, before they even gave it a chance.

Last time I was on a train was in 1975, when I left from Prescott Ontario, to Montreal Quebec...... In hindsight it was probably the most spiritual ride of my life... All woods, little farms and houses.... NO citys. NO Concrete, no waiting in traffic.... Just me and my thoughts, with God and the Forrest, and a road made from steel.... It was great...

My son Derek takes the train home from Chicago when he can. Sad to say it only goes as far as Syracuse NY.... Had Ogdensburg had they're shit together, we could of had the same opportunity..


I do have a huge garden now, and plan on having plenty of tomatoes. Which will be way ripe for the Fall shows... LOL.... ( HINT: Wrap the green ones in newspaper and store them in a cool dry place... You'll have red ones for Thanksgiving....


Just in case.....

Like the old story goes, aim low, in case they're crawling...

If our elected government hadn't cut the tax rate on the 1% uber-wealthy and created such a massive deficit they wouldn't be running around trying to cut programs now. They are trying to shrink government the back door way instead of being up front about it. Create an artificial crisis (the tax cut create huge deficit), and come up with a solution that is within their political agenda (slash spending on unwanted programs - public radio and television - mass transit - military facilities in the "blue states"). Sound familiar? Create an artificial crisis (WMD's in Iraq) sollution that fits political agenda (finish Daddy's War - remove dictator gone crazy they propped up - like Noriega in Panama).

The NY Times had a wonderful article today on the huge tax cut for the uber rich who supported this administration’s run for power.

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/07/07/busin ... ?th&emc=th

Here are two quotes if you don't want to read the whole article:

"The large share of the tax windfalls received by the wealthy are not spent in the short run. And even among those who are induced to spend more, the main effect is not increased demand for domestically produced goods and services, but rather increased bidding for choice oceanfront property and longer waiting lists for the new Porsche Carrera GT. Such spending does little to stimulate domestic employment." - to which I might add, no duh!

Want more -

"Had the dollars required to finance the president's tax cuts been used in other ways, they would have made a real difference. Larger tax cuts for middle- and low-income families, for example, would have stimulated immediate new spending because the savings rates for most of these families are low. And their additional spending would have been largely for products made by domestic businesses - which would have led, in turn, to increased employment.

Grants to cash-starved state and local governments would have prevented layoffs of thousands of teachers and police officers. And many useful jobs could have been created directly. For instance, people could have been hired to scrutinize the cargo containers that currently enter the nation's ports uninspected."

Or as Arlo points out maintain alternative transportation that might be good for all kinds of issues including global warming, and giving us something to sing about.

Paul Burke

That's how we're going to feel out here when the last old growth redwood gets turned into a cocktail table for Ahnold and the way we may all someday feel when the last polar bear dies of skin cancer in ANWR.

But I think it's a good thing that we are in such good, conservative hands. I'm beginning to think that putting these guys in charge of anything that requires prudent judgement - budget, history, military, environment,...- is like taking a drunk to a party with a hosted bar.

Arlo keeps saying that in a world like this, it takes so little to make a positive contribution, but I think that it will take a lot more than a lot of positive contributions to make us proud of ourselves again. After all, we elected them; not once, but twice. I think we need Woody to come back and remind us that it's OUR world.

Mark

haze: yeah I'm a tree hugger. I'm fighting just to keep my back 40, with saplings left by the ice storm of 98, when I lost all my shade trees.. ( least they missed the house) ouch!!! Just some Black Locust trees, and allot of sumack, with lots of cool bushes... Pussy willows ect... They only have an eight inch diameter, yet my neighbors keep suggesting I cut them down. My blue spruce have rocketed to 15 ft. Something I planted after the 98 storm....

My neighbor offered me 50$ for every tree I cut down, so he could have a better view of the river.... Too bad, the gentleman, that didn't like trees past on this past spring.... I always wondered why he didn't build an upper deck, to view the river... But everyone has they're ways....

I must say, they've been pretty good, and take no for an answer... ( they don't want to pay a surveyor, as it wouldn't be wise to cut a tree close to a property line, without paying to have it surveyed....

That sparks allot of memorys. Altho I must confess I've never been on the west coast, and haven't yet seen a Redwood....

But it reminds me of my days in the Lumber industry... I just know it's hard fuckin work, but the money is there. In the 80's we took a contract to clear cut a forrest on this creek that led to a lake.....We'd wack off 50 -100 acres a yr, for about 5 consecutive yrs. It was something to be in a virgin forrest cutting down, such beautifull trees, knowing if you weren't there doing it, someone else woulda been in your shoes. Everyone has to eat...

Yeah some of the prettiest trees I ever saw, I would enjoy for a wk or so. ( I had to learn to do this after awhile or there was zero fun in it ) But after we reached them, they were circled, they went down/ quite an adrenaline rush, cutting down a 200ft. (150 ' I exaggerate ) Hardwood Cherry tree, with a 3 ft diameter... That's a big tree for North NY... We cut everything... Maples, Oak, Ash, and Beech.... Allot of beach... Huge diameter trees..... Hickory i guess is another favorite... Love the bark.

When the 500 acres was all clear cut, it turned into a big swamp.. the state dropped they're hands from the project and went on to butcher something else I suppose... \\

I do know as a woodsman of sorts, that those trees will never repopulate, as they need some shade to re-birth a forrest... Clear cutting. Is devestating....

The states original intention was to clear cut, a 500 acrea forrest on fish creek and flood it, making it into a small lake... it was a dumb idea, when they thunk of it...

But it was like looking a gift horse in the mouth, but having to vanish one of your favorite forrest spots from your memory banks.....

Trust me NO one got rich but the state, that started the brainstorm with some huge grant, that one of the former Gov... roused up.....

Remember NY has a pretty bad track record for Goveners.... Remember Rockafeller??????????

I guess all boiled down, I know how it feels to be on both sides of the fence.

I am not that much of an environmentalist, but I'm alarmed at the way that people seem to feel that everything should be decided by the market. There seems to be some sort of religion that formed after the fall of the Berlin wall that believes that the free market is the source of all truth. Should we let CONO die? Let the market decide. Is it profitable?
I think we need to remember that this is the same market that thinks of equity as paying a grammar school teacher $40K per year and paying a guy that can kick a ball through two sticks $1 million per year. I'm worried that we are not taking the time to establish our values as a society. Because, from watching my son, I understand that it really is all about values and you can't depend on the market to establish them. I know Reagan made ideology a dirty word, but I think we may need to elevate it again. Because, based upon pure financial analysis, you should have just cut all the black locusts down at $50 a pop. Seems from your post, that clearly would not reflect your values. I think that's true of the redwoods, the whales, the glaciers, the ozone layer,... You'd never find me sitting in a tree marked for removal, even the last redwood, but that does not mean that I think the market is reflecting my values. I think of that Quote,


I'm afraid that that may be closer to my personal values than the interests of the timber industry. Either the City of New Orleans has value to us or it doesn't. And that discussion needs to precede the one about whether or not it's profitable, not follow it. CONO's value does not come from how profitable it is. That's the point I was making with my comments. But I do think you made the right decision with regards to your black locusts and sumac (don't tell your neighbor). Do you ever make sumac tea? It's a lot like lemonade. My brother lived near Hartford, and they were all over the place there. It really quenches your thirst.

I side with mikey (Hey, mikey!) & Arlo on this, too.



It's not the regular, convoluted political world anymore. It's more like Alice. Not THAT Alice! The one in Wonderland. there's an unreality to the corruption and control that's going on.

I'm not too optimistic about the rail or anything that doesn't have Big Something behind it.

So sorry, folks.

Wahhhh.......

Trains are a major part of the hisstory of this country whether it is for passenger or cargo it is something that needs to be preserved. If you have never had a chance to "hop" a ride I suggest you do. This is a part of history that deserves saving.

...so in the world gets stupider department......there may be a light at the end of the (train) tunnel.....if these folks can get funding imagine what Amtrak might do.....
check out
http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/60minut ... 3415.shtml
and click on "Handouts for the Homeland".....

This country has becomed so consumed with turing a profit that we have forgotten how to fix. or come up with alternatives. Instead we decide to destroy, dismantle and destruct what can be fixed. We have underground trainways. we have trains to take 15 miles from the burbs to the city. We maintain our cargo transportion. HMMMM! What's the story There George W. afraid your buddy Cheney is gonna to have to re think his budget cause we as people want more effcient modes of transportation. Like steam and solar. This is just the my humble opinion. Please make sure the tomaotes are soft.

Thanks, Arlo, for sharing the information about the cuts to Amtrak. After reading the article you posted, I felt sad about those huge cuts to public transportation. It's the public who will suffer and be inconvenienced. I think that train travel is relatively safe, low-cost, and efficient.
I remember years ago, when there were so many plane crashes. Apparently, the government had cut back on maintaining the airplanes, and because these airplanes were not properly serviced, checked, and maintained, that's why there were so many plane crashes. Also, there were more airplanes companies flying in the air, competing with each other for business. That's free enterprise for you.
I see an erosion in the quality of American life. With the 55% cuts to Amtrak, I wouldn't be surprised if that money was put into war in the Middle East or trying to fight terrorism.

Caron - You aint kidding, erosion cant be stopped. But I think it is more of an adaption and evolving of American Life. It sucks, but it is happening. I had a conversation with my wife about gun control and DNA. About how everyone is complaining about it being unconstitutional. Heck, if you arent going to be committing crimes with guns and leaving DNA at scenes, what do you have to worry about? Plus, the constitution is WAY outdated, look who wrote it and when they wrote it.

If it means less crime and senseless death...Im for it.

But back on topic, the train is a cool way to travel, but it has its demons. Ask the plains indians.

I'm not sure, but I'll make a small wager that the real demons are the commercial rail-road companies that have no interest in having to share track with AMTRAK.

adg

The folkslinger's got it right again. The "bad guys" in the story are the railroad companies that, one-by-one, let their passenger service fall apart as a prelude to total abandonment of their lines during the fifties and sixties. This led to the creation of Amtrak in 1971. Interestingly enough, Amtrak owns many miles of track directly (mostly in the Northeast Corridor), while it has usage rights to tracks owned by the railroads elsewhere. One of the reasons long-distance Amtrak trains have a poor on-time record generally is that the railroads give their freight trains priority over the passenger trains "sharing" the route.

Go here for some historical context:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amtrak